community.kjrh.com

socal:
11:39 a.m. Jay still on the nest, brooding. I'm only in for a sec, gang.... But I have to share I'm very sad about something. I have noticed that a whole lot of Observation about what we're seeing on the Kay and Jay nest is going on on the Chat area now... and we're not getting a permanent record of all of that observation here.... There are going to be a lot of holes in the observations now, it seems, due to that.... Very sad. I miss observing with a whole bunch of ya at once here.... Now most of you are over on the chat, and just a handful of us are carrying on the permanent record of observations here.... Sorry to be a sourpuss about it... but, maybe it'll change... This is a very organic Forum.... Thanks for listening.... socal.

RUSSELL's Post (from the other thread...):
I'll weigh in here. The live chat does not preclude us from keeping records. In fact, I'd wager to say the rate of posts in the observation thread is much higher already than it was last year, and we have a lot more people contributing.

I put the chat up because it gives people a chance to experience the hawks together in real time. I don't believe it detracts from the forums; but that's just my opinion.

I'm always open to suggestions and feedback... so I'm interested to hear what people say. However, this topic should not be in the observation thread IMHO so if you want to reply make a new topic.

(8-{)
Russell Mills
Online Content Director
KJRH-TV Channel 2
PO Box 2 Tulsa, OK 74101
(918) 748-1560

The FIRST and ONLY station in Oklahoma to broadcast local news in HD!

SOCAL's REPLY TO RUSSELL:
I am carrying my reply over from the Big Sit thread where I started this discussion and Russell kindly replied... I want to make it clear that I totally appreciate all that you have done for us here, Russell... and it could just be a grumpy middle aged gal having problems adjusting to change :-). I am, however, interested in what others have to say about this topic...
And again, Russell... Thank you for all you do.

- socal

I agree strongly wiith socal. The fact that documtation is being scattered around in several locations distresses me too. And I was completely unaware of it til socal posted this.

That said, I am nobody's boss except my cats (and that is therefore, a debatable job title).

Personally, I simply do not have the time to be involved in both the chat and the forum. With a life of too little time and too much to do, like socal, I can't do both. My choice.

Unfortunately, as folks are apparently documenting nest activities over there on the chat, I will never know about it. My choice, my loss. And of course, that makes me a far less informed reporter/observer as I am missing half the evidence.

Russell has made his stand clear...

So, socal, you and I will have to blunder around in the dark over here at the forum, unaware of all that lost documentation. It is sad. I agree. But I am at an age that I realize that there are things I can affect, and things I cannot, and the sense I get from Russell's part of the exchanges, is that he wants both the chat and the forum as documentary repositories. And he is the boss.

Sad indeed.

I think that those of us who feel a need to document things for history or posterity or whatever will post in the forums - many of the posts in the chat are made by newcomers to watching the hawks - things like is that Jay? and does she always rearrange the nesting materials - I think those of us who post observations over there should make an effort to copy them to the forum and post them here - we really don't need to make our laundry observations in the forums - as I did last night -

Copying observations over to the forum is good, because otherwise some of us will never even know about them. Unfortunately I suspect that if one wanted to be complete (and had the time to involve themselves in now TWO areas), I would still have to do chat catchup AND Forum checkup several times a day. I don't have time for that. Maybe it is time for this old lady to drop back to being a lurker. Suddenly this nest watch has become twice the size and twice the labor.

I agree with Catbird.  I will become a quiet watcher.  I think both forum and chat are good, I just don't want to worry about what I post where. 

Catbird:

I agree strongly wiith socal. The fact that documtation is being scattered around in several locations distresses me too. And I was completely unaware of it til socal posted this. That said, I am nobody's boss except my cats (and that is therefore, a debatable job title). Personally, I simply do not have the time to be involved in both the chat and the forum. With a life of too little time and too much to do, like socal, I can't do both. My choice. Unfortunately, as folks are apparently documenting nest activities over there on the chat, I will never know about it. My choice, my loss. And of course, that makes me a far less informed reporter/observer as I am missing half the evidence. Russell has made his stand clear... So, socal, you and I will have to blunder around in the dark over here at the forum, unaware of all that lost documentation. It is sad. I agree. But I am at an age that I realize that there are things I can affect, and things I cannot, and the sense I get from Russell's part of the exchanges, is that he wants both the chat and the forum as documentary repositories. And he is the boss. Sad indeed.

Okay I guess I'll take the time to add some additional thoughts.

No one is under any obligation to participate in either the forum or the chat.

The chat was posted to complement existing material, not to replace or "fix" it.

Last year, it took a week to generate 5 pages on the observation thread. This year, we have 13 pages in less than 24 hours. Don't see that as a step backward.

Now I'm happy to make a second page which has ONLY the video player on it. In fact I'll go ahead and do that anyway. (We'll call it "Hawks Nest Lite") That way, anyone who feels distracted by the chat or has a hard time loading the main hawk page can go there instead. Hopefully this solution will keep everyone happy. If not -- well, in this business you learn quickly that there's no such thing as keeping everyone happy :)

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(8-{)
Russell Mills
Online Content Director
KJRH-TV Channel 2
PO Box 2 Tulsa, OK 74101
(918) 748-1560

The FIRST and ONLY station in Oklahoma to broadcast local news in HD!

Thank you Russell and KJRH for allowing the camera on the nest, the forums, and the chat.  I really enjoy them all.  I would like for us to look at creating some curriculum for teachers to use this summer.  While the hawks are fascinating - they are also an incredible opportunity to educate children in the ecosystem and our place in it.  I could even see a children's book using some of the photos of Kay, Jay, Thunder and the ones to come yet.

Socal, I've had concerns about this, too. In fact, Bville and I have discussed this very issue via e-mail, and I'll quote may take here:

As for the various venues on the forum, like you, I don't intend to "live" in the chat room. In fact, I studiously avoided it for a day and a half. But it is handy for immediate responses to questions or issues that arise, and so I'll probably keep an eye on it and use it from time to time.

As for how people conduct themselves or what they discuss in the chat room, I don't care as long as it's civil. I think it's appropriate to try to recruit people who are making observation-type comments in the chat room and try to get them to post in the forum threads. We could use more people in the forum; maybe it would allow us to work out some sort of loose schedule so there could be full coverage while we still had actual lives.

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"Freedom of the press is guaranteed only to those who own one" –– A. J. Liebling

Hello Folk's, I'm more for posting on the new season's  Big Sit-In forum. I don't mind the chat line, heck it's easier for me to post, but lack's indivual's prespective on how they see Kay and Jay throughout day and night time watching. Call me birdbrain but I prefer everyone's indept, insightful and witty view's here.  Geesh I'm tripping over myself, anyway it's hard to explain it, but hope you get my drift folk's.

Yes, it has been a little confusing as it is still new.  For the most part, I think people have been doing a pretty good job getting the observations down on the thread and doing a lot of chatting on the chat.  A lot of chatting that would be cumbersome to wade through in the observation thread and would do nothing for establishing more camaraderie among the usual hawkwatchers as well as all the new ones that are peeking in.
I have been watching.  For the most part, even if people make an observation on the chat thread, they or someone else is documenting it on the forum.  I always have the 2 pages up anyway to watch the video and to post on the forum - so its easy for me to jump back and forth.  I do not run the video on a separate player - I just use the main hawk page as I can see it just as well - I lose too much quality if make it bigger in different window.

I think it is all evolving just fine - especially since so much of what I have to add is just chat - like I will go do a drive by the station or ones plans for the day.  If I am busy posting on the forum, the ding that someone has left a chat message often clues me into that I need to look at the video stream instead!

Like Russell said, you all have not had any trouble posting 13 pages of observations  in 24 hours.  I don't think much was missed.  The only little blip may have been while you were waiting for me to start the nesting thread - then observations were ending up on chat.

I really appreciate everybody's views on this so far....

Russell, I was really feeling bad about griping, and hoping that you weren't feeling like all you've done for us was going unappreciated. It's wonderful that you are going to create the "Hawks Nest Lite" page! I hope that works better for those of us who are now, suddenly, having trouble loading the existing page.... Also, Russell, it is obvious, from some posts today, that what you have created is appreciated and used ... And it is also obvious to me now that there were certainly others having the same thoughts and feelings about what was evolving as a result of it all... I'm just the one that happened to break the ice openly about it...

No one is right here... And no one is wrong. What is true is that there are some of us simply concerned with the flow of documentation on the permanent record... And, as well, there are those of us experiencing a bit of a sense of loss , realizing that some of the chit chat about the Kay and Jay observation topic was off happening in a parallel universe somewhere else ... and that those same "some of us" did not have enough time to keep up with it all ....

So, in short... As Catbird so eloquently put it, it is my choice that I will be mainly focusing my energy here in the Observation thread area.... And by that choice, yes, I'll probably be missing out on alot. I do acknowledge that. But that is a choice I have to make now. I do want to thank those who have shared here ... And continue to look forward to seein' y'all in the Forum!

Hugs to you all ! You, especially, Russell !!! Thanks, and please forgive me for being such a pain in the &%% !!!!

No worries hon hopefully the "lite" page offers a workable solution.

Who says you can't have the best of both worlds?

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(8-{)
Russell Mills
Online Content Director
KJRH-TV Channel 2
PO Box 2 Tulsa, OK 74101
(918) 748-1560

The FIRST and ONLY station in Oklahoma to broadcast local news in HD!

Socal, it was an issue that needed to be raised, and I'm glad you did it. Since we're making things up as we go along, it's absolutely an appropriate topic for discussion. I'd be interested to hear his opinion, but I'd guess Russell is also fine with your concern. After all, the whole purpose of the forum is to create the best atmosphere for the biggest participation. Otherwise, why have it in the first place?

Like you, I will spend a minimum of time participating in the chat room, preferring to devote whatever time I spend here to creating some sort of "permanent record." (Don't get me started on what's "permanent.")

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"Freedom of the press is guaranteed only to those who own one" –– A. J. Liebling

KJRH Webmaster:

No worries hon hopefully the "lite" page offers a workable solution.

Who says you can't have the best of both worlds?

There you go, Socal.

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"Freedom of the press is guaranteed only to those who own one" –– A. J. Liebling

(sniff, sniff)... Thanks, guys. I was thinking maybe I should go and crawl under a piece of bark somewhere.... You are all the very best... You KNOW that, don't you ?!?!